DanielInTheLionsDen.us / ThoseWhoKnow -- you are here.      
Those Who Know:
This list is those of Authority or Profession apprised of this life threatening situation early on, and up to now.
The question is, what have they done so far, and what will they do?
You need to ask them!  -- This is about your safety, and their responsibility for it!

List is in order of apprisal or notice (information taken from my daily log -- with clarifications added):
Tom Rodgers
Thomas L Rodgers (me) Sun Feb 10. Did diligence, discovery & disclosure of physical facts for CO poison. My attention and involvement was initiated by father's call for help, Feb 10, 2008

(Tue Feb 12 2008, Infant with parents where referred by Dr Robert Armstrong to PCMC in Salt Lake City, Ut.)

Thomas L Rodgers (again me) Wed Feb 13: Was my first visual contact with parents David and Mary Conrad and their infant, Daniel, at Primary Childrens Medical Center  -- I noted indications of serious toxicosis in parents as well as the infant,

Dr Robert Armstrong Thur Feb 14: Early next morning, Feb 14 2008, 7:30 I called and spoke to referring physician Dr Robert Armstrong (IHC Manti Clinic). I indicated my observations and ask him to pursue a complete Toxicology screening of all family members as I perceived obvious symptoms of potent Environmental Poisoning -- possibly including Carbon Monoxide (as my gut feeling and long experience included that possibility). (He listened, but did not assure me with positive responsive to my suggestion.)

Rep Bradley Winn Thur Feb 14:  Discomforted in my conversation with Dr Armstrong, I sought out Rep. Bradley Winn (whose district includes Manti, Utah) in Legislative session at the Utah State Capitol (where I already was in attendance for other legislative efforts). I told him of the Conrad's situation and their toxic physical appearance, and of my dissatisfaction with a less than serious response from Dr Armstrong. I asked him to call Dr Armstrong and press for toxicology testing. He committed to call Dr Armstrong for me,

Dr Sarah Lamb of PCMC / IHC Thur Feb 14 that same day, at legislative lunch break, I returned to 
Primary Children's Medical Center, I spoke to attending Pediatrician Dr Lamb. I explained my experienced observations of the obvious poisoning markers and symptoms apparent in parents as well as infant. She with a blank look only tolerated my discourse, then ignored my petition to test for (to at least rule out) environmental poisoning. I left feeling her disrespect and that she would not honor my observation.

Back at Capitol, same day, I revisited Rep. Bradly WInn, and shared with him, Dr Lambs apathetic response. He committed again to call Dr Armstrong and press a response for me.

Senator Darin Peterson Feb 14: Still at Capitol I sent written note into Senate Chambers for Senator Darin Peterson (Manti Utah is in his Senate District) also explaining Conrad family's situation (I did not immediately speak to or ask him to call Dr Armstrong as I anticipated that Rep Winn would satisfy my request and obtain positive actions from Dr Armstrong, Dr Lamb and PCMC)

Fri Feb 15. I brought copies of Thaxton-Christiansen story flier to Capitol for Rep Winn and Sen. Peterson.
I checked again with Rep Winn. He stated he had left message for Dr Armstrong, and had not recieved response. I repeated my request for him to call, and then backed that up with a request to Sen Peterson to also call, as I knew that as time passed, identifying the poisoning agent in the blood [or tissues] in the family members would become more difficult or an opportunity lost altogether. I had even suggested to Dr Lamb at PCMC, in my Feb 14 petition with her, that initial blood draws should be conserved for expanded analysis and verification if so deemed later. That professional suggestion of mine was
also ignored as another mute concept with her and Dr Armstrong. Why? If you really do want to identify a disorder or disease, as you "claim" you do, you retain your options for further analysis! -- which as a matter of practice, I did. That habit of dedicated diligence and pursuit of biological fact is how I identified the CO poisoning in the Thaxton-Christiansen case, when the dozens of other "so-called" professionals, including IHC's PCMC and the State instead took the Thaxton/Christiansen nursing infant away for eight hellish months and treated him for everything else but Carbon Monoxide, while they returned the rest of the Thaxton family to their toxic environment and nearly killed the entire family -- just like they did in this case again -- had I been not been contacted and intervened!

-- Don't you see it yet? This why I press and persist in my desperate urgency to get these expensive and pretentious Medical fellows and State Agency players to do their jobs right the first time around! Or to at least make honorable corrections (in compliance with their Hippocratic oath) when they are found in error.

AG Office Fri Feb 15  I briefly explained concerns to clerk (Jennifer?) and asked for suggestions of contacts,

During that same day I shared the details of this case known to me at date with my associates and friends also laboring at the Capitol during the Legislative session, Including Gayle Ruzica her team of Utah Eagle Forum and many of my friendly legislators.

Sat and Sun Feb 16 & 17 operating on "gut feelings" and genuine concern, I Prepared and drove to Manti to view and investigate environmental situation of the Conrad family. Once there in Manti, curiously, I was instantly obstructed and impeded in my attempts to communicate with neighbors or associates to ascertain from their observations, the Conrad family's Winter health experience.
 Fresh Air Adder, Water Heater and Furnace stacks
Mon Feb 18, at the first morning light I drove to the Conrad home and I saw the actual problem: The Furnace and Water Heater exhaust and Fresh Air Adder configuration -- that you clearly see here in this website -- so incredulously stupid in design, yet "approved" as so to draft fumes right back into and enter the family's home through the entire Winter (and Summer with AC function)!  -- if your home has this similar problem, please go to What You Must Do: and file your complaints!

Made early attempt (~ 7:30 am) to contact Dr Armstrong at his home (he
lives in same neighborhood, right around corner, only three houses away) -- no answer at his door.

Later in morning I took kindly Gill Yardley, who most people in Manti know, with me back to the Conrad home to be familar local face for the chance of assuring observing neighbors and as a witness as I walked around to the back yard and photographed the Conrad home and its exhaust arrangement on the roof.

We returned to his "Yardley Inn" (where I was lodged). I shared with the mothers (friends and patrons of the Yardley Inn and Spa) my discovery of the Conrad home's life threatening construction. That happenstance gathering included key members of that community and its administrative agencies. So Manti City, that community, this State and its Bureaucracy then became without excuse of ignorance -- as those mothers, wives and agents themselves now knew the truth -- and could see and demonstrate it to others.

I made another attempt to contact Dr. Armstrong at his office. I was denied with "he is way too busy to talk to you".

Bshp. George Richardson: Later I went to Conrad family's closest next door neighbor, Bshp. George Richardson, as I wanted to let him know what I discovered about the Conrad's house (I knew he had seen me with Gill in the early morning as I photographed the house and exhaust arrangement earlier); and for my own diagnostic confirmation, I wanted to ask him what he had noticed in terms of the whole family's health throughout the Winter, as an outside, but caring, observer -- because those who are being subtly CO poisoned may lose reaction speeds, sense of time and urgency. operate in a slow dream-like state and may not notice their own subtle poisoning! -- But as he answered the door, he said he had been told not to speak to me, and closed the door!  So I was unable to explain the Conrad family's exhaust poisoning problem to him or to learn of any observations he may have had of the entire family's appearance and evident health during the whole Winter -- or to give him possible answer for other individuals or families in his Congregation who might have likewise suffered seriously illness in similarly configured homes during this past Winter! -- so sadly, that opportunity to benefit those others similarly made ill was also obstructed.

-- This curious obstruction of communication showed up everywhere in the community as I attempted to alert even the City and Community leaders of the Furnace Exhaust issue in their hundreds of manufactured homes, and to have them check on, alert or help the young mothers, elderly, widows or handicapped, in the event of snow capping or deep cold causing more poisoning in the housing with the similar exhaust configurations. But it was reported to me that the members of the entire Manti Community had been told -- even before I got there (on Feb 18) -- that I was "up to no good", and that they were not to speak to me. -- Why?

I began calling trustworthy friends and family in area and explaining what I had found with the Conrad home (and about the curious obstruction of communication with the neighbors and community).

Tue Feb 19  in morning I shared the furnace exhaust issue with more friends who were patrons at the Spa (where I was graciously  lodged, as I did my investigation and documentation -- the photos, videos and data herein). In that setting appeared kindly Gene Hagloch who was "home taught" by David Conrad. So I was finally able to get an objective observation of the Conrads physical appearance and indications of their health through the Winter. Gene said he had noticed, along with baby Daniel's challenges, the marked decline in the whole family's appearance. health and vigor as the Winter cold and snows deepened, and of his and everyones concern, but no-one found an answer. But the ignorant gossip and ultimate accusations (hence the senseless medical and nutritional neglect charge and actions filed against them) was that it was all due to the family's Vegetarian lifestyle. Because of Gene's wiser perceptions he didn't accept that nonsensical gossip, but could not find answer until now, so in his sincere love for the family, he was relieved to finally know the true cause of infant Daniels struggle and the whole family's harm. He arranged to go with me to the house (the next morning) and be another witness to the real problem.

Peggy Layton also happened to be in that gathering of patrons and suggested I have her husband, Scott Layton, owner/operator of Layton Plumbing also go with me to witness the house; which I did that afternoon.

Scott Layton, the kind owner/operator of Layton Plumbing, came with me that afternoon Tue Feb 19 to witness the exhaust problems. He easily recognized its setup for harm.
(Scott also later joined
[see photo] former Senator Parley Hellewell, Mike Anderson, John Hale of the Sanpete Messeger Newspaper and me again on Feb 29 to witness and document issue.)

Scott Layton referred me to an other kind friend, Todd Mortenson of Trade Winds HVAC, in Manti, but pressed for time, I didn't catch Todd at home or make contact with him until recently. He now understands this problem and
if you live in his Community, he can analyze your home and test for CO where suspected.

(Continued excerpts from my daily log)
2-20-08: “…took Gene Hagloch to witness problem with house…noon…went to Dr Armstrong’s office and talked to him…gave him a copy of the Christiansen/Thaxton CO Case…explained PCMC’s refusal to acknowledge or pursue the CO factor in their case…reported what I had found with the Conrad house…asked him to go look at the house for himself (just around the corner from his house) and to pursue the Carbon Monoxide causation factor…got feeling Dr Armstrong was not taking me seriously…visited with Glen Bair, County Mechanic…explained situation…he said he’d go view the house in the morning.”

2-22-08:  “…since there had been no serious response from Dr Armstrong…attempted to see him in the office at noon…he would not see me.”

2-25-08:  “…4pm…went to Dr Armstrong’s office again…he would not see me…I wrote a note for his secretary to give him, stating that we had very strong physical evidence of a serious carbon monoxide problem with the house…I had his secretary initial the note and make me a photocopy of the note…took Glen Bair to house again (he had gone by himself on the 21st)…went to Ephraim to deliver a copy of the Christiansen/Thaxton CO Case that Representative Winn could keep at his house (the other copy would likely stay on site on Capital Hill)…did not catch Representative Winn at home…left copy with his wife…”

2-26-08:  “…had pictures developed…stopped at (former) Senator Parley Hellewell’s, showed photos”

2-27-08:  “…went to Capital Hill…noon…showed pictures to Representative Brad Winn…said he had still not heard from Dr Armstrong…said he would try to call him again…showed pictures to a number of people on Capital hill…went to hospital…showed pictures to Dr Lamb…no response from her…”

2-28-08:  “…showed pictures to a number of legislators and other key people on Capital Hill…evening…drove down to Manti.”

2-29-08:  “…morning…(Former) Senator Parley Hellewell, his assistant Michael Anderson; Scott Layton, and John Hale of the Sanpete Messenger came to document CO problem with house…drove back to Salt Lake to share this additional documentation with key people on Capital Hill.”

3-1-08:  “…back to Manti with video camera…got halogen lights from Glen Bair (County Mechanic)…videoed exhaust crossing fresh air adder throughout the night.”

3-2-08:  “…night time…videoed some more…”

3-3-08:  “…evening…on way back to Salt Lake, stopped in Ephraim at Representative Winn’s house to show video – he was not home, his wife was sick in bed…showed video (of exhaust vapors) to daughter on doorstep and asked her to let her dad know that I had video proof of the exhaust pathway…”

3-4-08:  “…went to Capital Hill…showed a number of key people video evidence…a special meeting was called by Senator Darin Peterson in Senate Chambers Lounge. Senator Darin Peterson, Representative Bradley Winn, (former) Senator Parley Hellewell, and Joshua Bennett were there…showed all the video evidence.” (Wade Farraway of the Attorney Generals office and DCFS Director Duane Betourney with other commitments weren’t able to make this meeting)…did meet later that afternoon with Wade Farraway and Kirk Torgensen of the Attorney General’s Office (with Joshua Bennett observing), then with DCFS Director Duane Betourney, showing them the video evidence.

3-5-08:  “…went to Capital Hill again…talked to a number of people…talked to Representative Bradley Winn…he still had not had a response from Dr Armstrong…

3-13-08:  “…stopped at Senator Darin Peterson’s in Nephi…he was upset with the lack of courtesy and no response from Dr Armstrong – not taking or returning his calls…went to Ephraim where Representative Brad Winn set up joint meeting with fellow Vise President of Snow College, Richard Wheeler…showed the video and explained situation…(Representative Bradley Winn reports that at some point after that meeting, he went and saw Dr Armstrong and had a discussion with him)…”

(To this day, Dr Armstrong along with PCMC continue to refuse to acknowledge the factor of a carbon monoxide involvement in Daniel’s Case.)

Others who have known since mid to late Febuary or early March:
 -- Ask those in authority or media (in bold) what they have done to alert or protect you.
(I have contact dates, details and more names to add 6/17tlr)

Dr Robert Armstrong, Manti Clinic, the very first person I notified of the family's
environmental poisoning, then presented the physical evidence to him, easily viewable as he (Dr Armstrong) lives only three homes away as neighbor to the Conrad family.
Dr Sarah Lamb Primary Children's Medical Center
Attorney General's Office
Duane Betournay, Director of DCFS
David Tibbs, Assistant Attorney General -- Counsel for the DCFS (initially, now recused)
Julie Lund, Assistant Attorney General -- Counsel for the DCFS
Judge Paul Lyman, 6th District Juvenile Court
Michael Jorgenson, Guardian Ad Litem
Bruce Zylks, DCFS
Lance Martin, DCFS
Annette Monson, DCFS

Governor's Office
Orrin Hatch, US Senator
Robert Bennett, US Senator
Chris Cannon, US congressman
Rob Bishop, US congressman
Jim Matheson, US congressman
Mike Leavitt, National Secretary of Health and Human Services            
Melissa Zito, Department of Health     
Sylvia Thomas, Director of Hispanic/Latino Affairs (65% occupancy of HUD homes in West are Spanish)

Richard Wheeler, Vice President, Snow College
Ralph Dewsnup, Dewsnup, King & Olsen Law Firm
Colin King, Dewsnup, King & Olsen Law Firm
David Olsen, Dewsnup, King & Olsen Law Firm
Scott Hintze, Manti Stake President
Walter Fife, 1st Counselor, Manti Stake
Michael Barclay, 2nd Counselor, Manti Stake
George Richardson, Manti 6th Ward Bishop
Ralph Squire, 1st Counselor, Manti 6th Ward
Brody Keisel, 2nd Counselor, Manti 6th Ward
Glen Bair, Sanpete County Mechanic
John Hale, Sanpete Messenger/Deseret News
Rebecca Palmer, Deseret News
Terry Orme, Salt Lake Tribune
Ted Mcdonough, City Weekly
Ingrid Quiroz, La Prensa Times (Hispanic Newspaper) (Ingrid did care enough to put a notice into her paper!)
Glades Gonzales, Mundo Hispano (Hispanic Newspaper)
Rene Torcatty, Telefutura/Univision (Hispanic TV)
Dick Gephardt, Channel 2 News
Rod Decker, Channel 2 News
Christina Flores, Channel 2 News
Bruce Lindsay, KSL News
Nadine Wimmer, KSL News
John Daley, KSL News     
Bob Evans, Fox 13 News
Hope Woodside, Fox 13 News
Sandy Riesgraf, Fox 13 News

This page is still in process of being written -- more is coming later (in meantime see MSWord doc. below):
I have close to 200 persons of responsibility and their dates of contact and knowledge to list here.

It will take me a while, as I also labor (with no resources but my own) to do what they (the names in bold) should have done! -- That is: to care enough about your infant's and family's safety to at the very least notify you!
So please return.  tlr 6/17/08

Those Who Know (Jun 23) in MSWord
(1 page for printing, to be used with "Daniel Flier NT")
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